Kayla O'Neill chats with children's book author and illustrator Paul Castle!

In this in episode of Early Childhood On The Go, we sit down with Paul Castle, a Canadian-born artist, author, and social media creator who’s redefining representation in children’s literature and online storytelling. Living with Retinitis Pigmentosa, a condition that causes gradual vision loss, Paul brings a powerful perspective on creativity, inclusion, and resilience.

Through his vibrant picture books, The Pengrooms, Pringle & Finn, Mr. Maple: A Guide Dog's Story, The Blind Robot and How to Raise a Dragon. Paul shares joyful, affirming stories that celebrate love, family, and identity. He also opens up about his journey as a legally blind artist, his partnership with his husband Matthew, and how their real-life story inspired his beloved penguin characters.

Join us as Paul talks about the importance of incidental visibility in early childhood stories and how he uses humor, art, and authenticity to connect with children and families. 

Find out more about Paul and his storytelling at Paul Castle Studios. 

Transcript

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Welcome to the Early Childhood On-The-Go podcast. We explore big ideas and practical ways to support every child's growth, curiosity, and sense of belonging. I'm Kayla O'Neill from the Early Childhood Center at the Indiana Institute on Disability and Community, and today we're talking about the power of imagination and inclusion and how stories help children to see the beauty in every kind of difference. Our guest, Paul Castle, is an author, illustrator, and an advocate whose joyful creative work celebrates the many ways people experience the world. Paul brings his lived experience as a person with a disability into his storytelling, offering perspectives that expand our understanding of creativity, community, and possibility. His books remind us that disability is a natural part of human diversity and that every child with the proper support and expectations can thrive and contribute in their own way. Paul, thank you so much for joining us today. To start, can you just share a little bit about your journey as an author and illustrator and kind of what first drew you to storytelling for children? Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me on the podcast, Kayla. It's so wonderful to meet you. You too. I'm excited to be here. You know, something that you said in the opening so resonated with me. It just hit me right in the feels. It was that that creating a sense of belonging for kids, you know, that's really what first inspired me on this journey because there's nothing more important in the world I think than that sense of belonging, that you belong, that is what inclusivity really is about. Sure. And so I've been telling stories my whole life since I was very very young when I was six years old I made my first children's book all on my own. I have a funny story. I have a seven-year-old and a 10-year-old. So I'm like, I got to hear this because my kids will make like little comic books. So I just would love to hear that little story. Oh, that's fantastic. That's so cool. I just like, you know, it's such a creative time in life when we're, when we're young and we're, we just, you know, kids love art. And as adults, so many of us just, just step away from it, right? We grow out of it. But when I was six, I stole a book off my brother's bookshelf. One, I didn't think he read it. It was called GI Joe's in Space. And I ripped out all the pages. I gutted it. And I taped in my own pages because I needed a book that had a nice hard cover, had to have a hard cover. My brother forgave me. He was like, oh yeah, that. And I wrote a story called The Sad Turtle. I found this book years later and it's a treasured item of mine it sits on my bookshelf and i was like the sad turtle, what is this, this is so, you know, i mean it's sad. He starts off, he's lonely he has no friends, he's all alone but he discovers friends throughout the story. I made this of my own volition on a weekend and my parents discovered it and kept it in a treasure box for many years afterwards. And it's so interesting to me because even revisiting that and seeing that, first of all, I had the desire to write and share stories as a kid, but I'm sort of connecting this with what you just said, because it was like, well, I felt a lack of belonging in my childhood because I was a kid who struggled to make friends, very introverted, very shy. I was dealing with an undiagnosed disability, my blindness, which was causing a lot of issues that you know would would take years to come to light and as a young kid at that age, I was grappling with the early early feelings and of of being different, that would later I would later recognize as being LGBTQ, as a gay person, I had those inclinations those those those understanding of my difference as young as seven and it took years of course for the vocabulary to reach me and to understand all of that but um it's interesting how this is all overlapping and coinciding so I'm dealing with my own sense of belonging in the world and I have these differences but I don't know how to identify them yet and I'm also passionate about art and telling stories. And I just took this into my teens and, uh, continue to draw and paint and tell stories. And I realized like, I'm, this is just what I'm drawn to sharing stories because I believe they can have an extraordinary impact on people. Because it was having an extraordinary impact on me when I would read and watch movies or any sort of form of storytelling could be so inspiring for me and I thought, I want to be the person who creates those things that inspire others, you know? Wow. That's how it all started. That's incredible and I think like obviously you know I work in early childhood and like we put so much emphasis on early literacy because of you know all of the more academic skills right and we're like, you know, have them draw pictures and all stuff to help with pre-writing but then you hear your story and that that emotional awareness and And what that probably did for you as a child emotionally, it just gives us, you know, what a great outlet for children, not only for those academic skills, but man, for processing things that they don't yet have the words to say. Exactly. Exactly. Yes. So when you think about inclusion, what does that look like in your creative process? us uh well okay so we fast forward to the point where I'm sort of making a decision to make, attempt, I should say, a career as an author because for years from college on I was it was a traditional painter at first okay and I did a lot of large-scale paintings and custom commissions things and I was really into painting as storytelling as a form of an opportunity and outlet for storytelling but I also needed to make a living you know I needed so I was putting my paintings up in restaurants and coffee shops and I managed to get into a few galleries it was really exciting but I eventually lost the ability to do that due to my my eyesight slowly degenerating because I was diagnosed at the age of 16 with a rare disease called retinitis pigmentosa. So that was like well how is this going to affect my life as a creative person as somebody who's very visual now I'm going blind permanently no cure no treatment and I uh so I but I was able to paint in my own way and adapt and adapt and when I finally was had to give up the traditional painting I discovered digital art or as people in my industry call it tradigital because it's sort of like still feels very traditional because it's like a pencil on a surface okay so we call it tradigital that's new for me but what it allowed me to do is access a lot of accessibility tools and so I was like okay this is exciting I started doing a lot of illustrations this way and then selling them online and then eventually I was like had all these characters and ideas and it was actually my husband who was like Paul you got to turn this into a book we got to make a book. And so I said okay well what's it going to be about and this was in 2019 and okay. Oh wow! Yeah we had just gotten married right before the pandemic. Oh man at least you got in before the pandemic, right? It was December yeah. Wow! And I had I had illustrated uh our wedding invitations he wanted he's like draw something cute for our wedding invitations and I chose penguins because they're like formally dressed you know they're in little rainbow bow ties on them and called them the pengrooms like a combination of penguins and I just thought it was cute yeah well it became a very popular illustration with our fan base because we had this little growing social media fan base and followers that we were like you know sharing our lives with and so when the pandemic hit and Matthew said it's time to create a story I said what should it be about he's like well obviously it's got to be about the penguins and I was like you know what that is a really good idea I think there should there needs to be this kind of representation in children's literature but it was very important to me Kayla that the book not be a quote-unquote message book too heavy-handed a message because i was writing the book for my six-year-old self yeah because i don't have kids and i was writing it for him and i was like what did little paul enjoy okay sure sneak in a message but i'm going to return to books again and again that are entertaining and fun and have exciting illustrations and humor, you know? And I said, I need to write a story that has representation as an incidental piece of the story, meaning you could remove it and the story still exists. So it's really just an incidental part of it. And why does that matter? Why is that important? Because we often get representation in this big, like heavy handed, this is what the story is about, educational sort of way kids aren't necessarily drawn to that kind of material if it's just part of the story well that represents life right right representation is just part of life it's just there it's not the central plot point it's just there and and I actually think it's even more powerful to tell those types of stories where the representation isn't the focal point it just exists that makes it so much more normal so much more like acceptable and so that's what set out to do and that's what the first book really did wow yeah that's it's so powerful and such a great perspective perspective about that that the story stands but that piece is there and it only enhances it and yeah I love just hearing that whole story of how that all came to be that is it's it's cool so cool to hear that you were writing books at six years old and here you are as an adult and you're doing it and you're writing books for yourself still that's amazing and I think how many kids are helped by that I mean you know the the best part of this whole journey is the feedback you know getting emails every day with photos of like parents with their kids reading the stories we have plushies too so kids clutching onto their little prinkle and fin plushies and you know it's just I mean I get emotional every day when I we get these messages because it's like wow I didn't expect it to feel so healing for my own inner child to see this happening and to know that I'm able to share something with people that is actually having a positive impact. And you kind of like fell right into my next question. So you're talking about you know what kinds of reactions have you received from children families teachers anything that's jumping out to you or that you want to share about because there's everything you know there's so many just wonderful wonderful I mean the feedback has just been phenomenal and um you know kind of tying into what I said the thing that I am so heartened by is when parents tell me like their kids request it night after night after night and I'm like they want to go back to the story because you know not because it's like oh it's the story that has the two dads and the two moms it's it's the story with the fun penguin the misadventures and you know all the little things that they do yet they are getting to experience stories with inclusivity at the same time and so that's just incredible and there is a there's several teachers all over the United States who tell me they read this and they've uh to their their classroom and have even worked it into the syllabus and like it's a teachable thing but like the kids really respond to it love it laugh along with it I have a teacher there's a pre-k teacher in Vermont oh my gosh she's turned it into a whole thing. She got she has the plushies, the Pringle plushie, and she hides it in her room every day and the first things that the kids have to do is find where oh my goodness hiding so apparently it's become such a popular part of her classroom year after year now that if a kid doesn't want to go to school for whatever reason a parent will say well if you don't go you won't find pringle and they'll go that gets them out the door. They need fun and i i love you know the fact that you can you have the plushies you can you know tying that play into early literacy and I mean that's just so that teacher is brilliant though because that's it's so brilliant I don't want to miss out she's just creating this FOMO for this kid yeah shout out to Miss Zachary Miss Zachary Shannon Zachary out in Vermont and she even sent me this packet once last year her students all drew pictures of pringle in their favorite hiding spot oh my gosh wow art yeah yeah i love that that is so cool um just all together she's just she's really thought of it all bringing the art back i know it's cool and these kids are going to be writing their own books they're going to be so i hope so i hope so yeah i want to inspire them to write their own books and stories too that's where it all starts you know that that spark starts so young how do you hope that your stories really influence the way children view disability and diversity yeah well again I really feel like because it's integrated into the stories I want kids to grow up realizing this is a normal everyday part of life diversity is around us and we love accept show grace show empathy and when you're surrounded by it and you're shown it and you see that oh this is just part of life I think it really opens the heart it makes it easier to accept diversity and embrace diversity and then the third thing, celebrate diversity. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's amazing. You know, you've shared kind of openly about how living with your disability has shaped your perspective as a writer, as an artist. How has that experience influenced your creative process? Oh, in a huge way, because I've had to adapt to vision loss over time, and as an artist, losing their vision. I mean, that is quite a quandary. There are many incredible blind artists all around the world doing incredible things. Now, part of my education is informing people something that quite a few of us don't know, even me. I didn't know this. I thought blind meant no vision. I grew up thinking because that's what television and movies tell us. But 93% of the blind community has functional vision so that varies extremely of course that can mean maybe you only see light light you know a bit of a bright light but some people like me have extreme tunnel vision so it's sort of like looking through a straw okay and I have no other vision no peripheral vision at all and and then some people have the opposite they have no central vision but they only have peripheral vision but these this is all forms of blindness and so educating people about blindness is super important. Now, having said that, people use what vision they do or don't have to accomplish many creative things, including art. And I'm very, very fortunate that I've been able to find ways to adapt to my vision loss and create art along the way. And like I said, I had to go from traditional to tradigital. There's our word of the day. And I've been so incredibly grateful to do that. So, you know, I need very specific conditions to get the work done, but I'm passionate about it. I love it. I will keep doing it. And, but it is because I have a progressive disease, I have to kind of keep adapting as I go. So my process has kind of slowed down a bit, but that's okay. I don't mind. I get to do this full time now. So that's amazing yeah that's what's been incredible so now I get to do it full-time the content creation and stuff takes a lot of time too but like, I really spend most of my days working on my books and I couldn't be happier about that. That's amazing and yeah, just always having to find ways to adapt and that must be a journey on its own. It really is it really is and there's this really interesting conversation having coming up right now about people with disabilities and the use of AI. I've seen a lot of people online talking about well AI is the only way that a disabled person can create art and I'm here to say that isn't true, you know I know so many incredibly talented disabled artists and I know that there are, I believe and I come from the school of, our obstacles often create amazing opportunities, rather than seeing the obstacles in your life whether it's like a chronic disease or some other issue we see those often as closed doors but I think we live in a time where they can often become greater opportunities it's really about a shift in perspective. And so by sharing your own personal stories and getting connected with other people who are dealing with similar things, I think you'll find an incredible community of strength that you wouldn't have had. Well, yeah, it provides an opportunity for connection and community. And yeah. And what's more important than that? I mean, really. Exactly. That's what we all need. That's what we all need. In early childhood education, we talk a lot about having high expectations for all children and the belief that every child can learn, can grow, can contribute. What does that phrase mean to you? Oh, it means a lot to me because I just, I'm the type of person that does not underestimate kids at all, at all. And I would never want to talk down to them. And I find that with a lot of like children's entertainment, sometimes I get very annoyed in books and television and movies where it's sort of like I hate to use this phrase dumbed down but it's sort of like it's speaking to kids in a way that doesn't respect how advanced kids can really truly be yeah and that sometimes kids don't have to in fact it's good when they don't understand everything right pepper no word or two that is beyond their reading level because that's going to teach them to grow learn ask questions about it right and kids are very good at filling in the gaps anyway so i am like in my my approach to writing and and creativity is you know make a few things a little mysterious a little out of reach a little bit of like okay i'm gonna take it's gonna take a little extra time to understand this but my my my um when i do readings and I'm always blown away by how how smart and inquisitive and intuitive kids are and I think that a lot of people forget that when they're creating for kids yeah no I think you know and you're making me think of so my kids recently I don't know how we got into this but we started watching like we're starting from the beginning of Mr. Rogers like we're going back to the beginning but he you know watching the way like he talks you know he's not dumbing stuff down. He is, he talks about emotions and things in ways that are so real. And like my kids will pick up on stuff if it's too cheesy, but he is like so subtle about it. So sorry. I'm kind of Roger's kick, but I think it relates to what you're saying about, you know, talking to kids about these things that are part of real life. And that's how he does. He just puts it out there and he really, you know, so yeah, we just watched like the very first episode the other night and I was like oh my gosh like I don't know it's fun I love it I'm like I'm sitting here like oh my god I need a Mr. Rogers re-watch right now like seriously I wish it would be like a thing because I and I didn't think my kids like I I don't know what made me like we should watch this and like they're like literally so interested in there I thought they'd be a little too old for it but the way that he talks about things and there's just a little bit of realness but yet there's some playfulness of imagination. And I think, you know, that brings kids in and keeps those expectations for them to learn. And I don't know. Yeah. If you have some time, just go back, start at the beginning. Yeah. That's so cool. That's so cool. And it's, it's telling that we kind of have to look back that far to find that because I don't think it's harder to find now. I can't think of something as I'm, like I said, going down this Mr. Rogers path. Like I can't think of something that's as similar as that and I mean I watched him growing up so I mean it's been a minute but man it could bring that back I know I know I know I worry sometimes I know but you know we'll do it we'll get that we'll go circle we'll get back to that I think so how can stories like yours help teachers and families challenge those stereotypes and really nurture children's confidence especially those with disabilities true yeah I think hmm you know again growing up growing up I think we all have a moment at least a moment growing up where we feel like we don't fit in oh my goodness everybody everybody forget it like we can all relate yeah you don't have to have a disability to know what it feels like to feel like you don't belong or you don't fit in. It's a universal experience. And I think that's the distinction I want to make. It's not so much like, oh, the disabled kid or the queer kid or, you know, the adopted kid is the only one who's feeling a little different and needs that attention. We all need it. And maybe that is what's most important because when every student in the classroom or every kid in the family or all the peer group friends understand that they are having the same universal experience it's just being expressed a little differently then you realize there's no outsiders anymore and that's why i that's the message i think is most important yeah i love that because you're exactly right you know whether everybody needs that sense of belonging and everybody feels that sometimes so you know bringing that together that belonging identity yeah yeah all under that same umbrella together and I think by emphasizing that it's the realization that every kid has that like oh okay you're you know you have this I have I have this going on but we're really the same and that really exercises that muscle of empathy I think when you know some kids are more inclined to be empathetic I mean, right off the bat, some have to really learn it through experiences. But I think when you learn empathy at a young age, it's going to set you up for the rest of your life. Oh, gosh, yeah. I wish, you know, it's so important. Like you said, some kids, it is going to take a little bit more to learn that. And some kids, maybe it does feel, but having that time, and I think using books, early literacy, writing, drawing, all that can help with that empathy. and I think you're right that's one of the things that you can get that if you can understand that yeah yeah that's great and you made a really good point it's not just about being read to it's also the creative process getting to play the play part the creative exercising your own imagination and reinterpreting things and then getting feedback through that process that's huge and that's so important and that's why I love hearing that your kids are doing these comics and stuff that's so awesome I love yeah it's it's fun to see you know and and and my kids are so different because I've got one that you know she could draw and she just loves and my other one not as much but every now and then he'll get into it and every kid's so different but I'm glad they're doing it and it's fun to see what they come up with you know oh I bet I bet for teachers for families what you know who really want to bring more inclusive practices into their classrooms or homes you know people like me what advice would you share you know I would I would really encourage finding stories that have subtle representation so that not every every time a kid is introduced to representation because kids are smart as we've discussed they're like oh it's another message but got it and they're only learning about inclusivity diversity when it's one of these books you know what I mean and they sort of compartmentalize it like oh it's that and if you seek out the stories that are more incidental like i've been emphasizing it's not so much like oh it's oh it's just there oh it's like a subtle hmm okay and i think that is going to have a bigger longer lasting impact because it's not again it's not separating it from the the group again it's about this feeling of when you are growing up and feeling different and you have a disability or various other things you always feel like you're being singled out or separated same thing with the books because eventually it's just going to emphasize this feeling of separation and difference. So integrative sort of subtle messaging, I think just makes it feel so much more casual and part of life. Yeah, exactly. How can educators use your books as starting points for conversations about belonging and identity? Oh, yeah. I mean, I get so many teachers reaching out, telling me how they've used the books in that way um as as a and a lot of parents who reach out with emails saying this was the perfect way to open discussions about you know uh uncle you know bill and tom like they have in the family like they have two you know uh gay parents or something like that or um representation of blind characters like let's have a conversation around disability and and they will often tell me that it starts when the the kid has a question kids are curious right endlessly curious very much so and so I think it's just a fun starting off like a springboard you know to have a fun story and then allow a conversation to develop love it um before before we wrap up, what's next for you? Do you have any upcoming projects or things that you're excited about in the, in the future? Yes, very excited. I have a lot of things going on. I, well, first of all, I'm currently writing my first middle grade novel. Ooh, okay. I want to hear about this. Yeah. Well, I can't, I can't tease too much, but I will say that there is a, the protagonist is low vision. So I'm really tackling disability but like in a nuanced way where it's not like it's just a blind character this this character has a disability and it's an exciting adventure story with you know it's going to be good it's going to be really like a fun story with some incidental some messaging in there about disability specifically and then I have two new children's picture books coming out next year one i'm so excited about it takes on uh internet bullying because i really feel like there aren't enough books that prepare kids for what is coming they may be too young to have their phones but they see mom and dad on their phones they understand what social media is and i think it's so important to be prepared for what that could look like so i'm working on a book called um it's called ned the internet troll oh it is about real trolls that live beneath the internet and they have a job to be mean and nasty except ned he doesn't quite fit in because he's a little too nice and this is a whimsical story that really explores how to approach that kind of bullying cyberbullying specifically um which i think is super important to have some early um preparation for that you know what i mean so um that's something that i and me as somebody who's very present online i've been the recipient of a lot of it and i've seen a lot of it happen so i think it's a really important topic and then my second book is the blind robot it's um i've been doing a web comic for the last few years called the blind robot and i have a fully illustrated children's book that has the characters in it goes on a fun journey again it's just more so about this like community and connection lots of humor and adventure a bit of an adventure story but of course there's a lot of important messaging in there too so uh that'll be coming out probably by next Christmas. That is so exciting. Thank you so much for coming here today and sharing all this with us. And I am so excited to see your new books come out. What a powerful reminder that when children see themselves reflected in stories of strength and joy, they learn that their experiences matter and that they belong. You can learn more about Paul's work and find links to his books in the episode notes. I'm Kayla O'Neill, and this has been Early Childhood on the Go. Thank you for joining us. And remember that every child brings something remarkable to the story of learning.